Spot on! My adult daughters view me as old, a fall and general health risk. (I admit to silently laughing a little while sharing empathy as they bemoan parenting and perimenopause.) At 65 my health, according to lab work is stellar and I can hike miles and miles up and down mountains. You have given me permission to embrace myself as vibrantly being mid-life. Thank you!
I am 83 and my husband is 84. We live in London and make a fair amount of use of the NHS. Everything you say rings true, in the sense that it sounds right, but it is NOT my experience. I am pretty healthy but every time I see a doctor, I feel he or she gives me all the time I need. I currently have a question mark over my breathing (I get out of breath easily) and expected doctors to say well, what do you expect, you're old. Not at all. They have sent me for checks of both heart and lungs (nothing amiss so far) and have treated me no differently than I would expect them to treat a young person. I attended a consultation of my husband with a heart doctor at a major hospital here in London and again, he could not have been more attentive.
I can't speak of other people's experience, but mine has been excellent.
I wonder if the British system is just more attentive? I really wonder if this a personal experience and you’ve hit the jack pot or if the American system is just a lot shittier? fascinating. And so happy i you have had a great experience.
Just a further note, that I asked said husband if he has experienced any poor treatment for being old and he said that with his most recent trip to the Emergency Department (just four weeks ago, he had had a fall and was concussed), he felt he got a little bit of priority because he was 84.
Well, everyone speaks about “The NHS” but really, it’s just a set of individual doctors with a common managerial system. We may be very lucky with the doctors we have seen, but I honestly have never heard any friend complain about how they were treated by doctors. (They complain a lot about waiting time and the difficulty of getting an appointment, but that’s a separate issue and affects everyone, not just old people.) I may ask friends, including one aged 100, as I meet them whether ageist prejudice is anything they have experienced.
I am American by background and 40+ years ago was pregnant in the US and worried I was having a miscarriage. My mother sent me to her gynaecologist who was incredibly patronising - my husband had to come into the consultation at one point and was shocked by the way the doctor talked to me. He said he was ready to punch him in the face!! In the end, I did have a miscarriage (on Labour Day, I always thought it was ironic) and the doctor in the local hospital was brilliant. But that’s another story. In the end, I did have a successful pregnancy who is now a middle aged academic teaching English literature.
I love these two lines especially: "The stories they told, and laughed at, and raged over, were shared in the spirit of resistance. They were making sense of how they were being treated." As with most things about being human, the predominant ways to cope are laughter and/or rage. Our entire existence is absurd, and yet we come equipped with a brain that wants to "make sense of" it. I suppose that becomes more acute as we get closer to the end. ... Another interesting essay, Kim.
okay. i just lost my comment bc im tech challenged and this app is a mystery to me and i dont plan on doing anything to change that. so here it goes again:
I am super fascinated by all the beautiful (inside and out) active healthy wise-ones in this community. I can’t bring myself to use the “O” word. What I am most curious about is if they live in the US or overseas. The most notable thing to us both after living abroad is just how many “grey hairs” (everyone comfortable with that? lol) we see all over. traveling. biking. hiking. socializing. everywhere! and in the small community we live in my husband and i both in our 50’s are the spring chickens. where we moved from in the states was booming and we quickly started to feel that old folk treatment despite being super active and healthy. it’s something we’ve come to really appreciate here. quality of life no matter how old you are. i can’t help but feel that in the US we do tend to tuck “them” away. when was the last time you saw a group of 6-8 “grey hairs” cycling across country? we just had a retired 70-something build us a garage by hand. super fit guy lifting stones that would break out backs for months. you all are inspiring and have my full respect and admiration. IT. CAN. BE. DONE!
I blame insurance too. I had a doctor tell me that he was "dinged" if he spent too much time with a patient. My prosthetist started his own business when his office was bought out by a corporation which wanted him to spend no more than 20 minutes with a patient, and that includes the time fitting the patient for a socket! Elders are neglected by many in the medical profession but the pressure to cut time. I talked maybe ten minutes with the doctor who just cut out my shoulder joint. The incision looks good, all seems good, but I deal with a physician assistant, not the technician - as I'm calling the no see him doctor. I'm sure it's cheaper but damn!
Thank you, this is all so important. Both my parents are dead now, my unhealthy dad from a sudden two week lung failure, my also unhealthy mom from a long slow nine year decline with dementia. In both cases, the local hospice organization was a godsend. People should know that hospice is not just for end of life care, but also for late-life advocacy. You might be able to get a hospice nurse or volunteer to help you advocate for your aging parents or for yourself. I annually give to our regional hospice organization because the people there do so much and are so needed.
Thank you for this reminder, Sarah. We should explore hospice more. I know they were a Godsend for my mom when my father was dying. He died at home and hopsice nurses and volunteers really kept her afloat emotionally. I need to lear more about the laste-in-life advocacy piece.
A couple of years before my mom died – when she was deep into dementia, but still had a lot of life in her – a hospice worker started visiting her regularly to check on her and make sure that her caregivers in the memory care unit of assisted living were giving her what she needed. I was only able to visit her once every one to two weeks, so it was reassuring to have another set of eyes on her and to know she was getting that extra bit of companionship.
Yes. But super hard to trust employees in facilities when they are treated very poorly by their corporate employers and have extremely high turnover, so still difficult to feel like someone else is there doing the job right. At the very, very end, though, hospice workers were essential in both of my parents' deaths. Key. Such an important role.
Thank you, Kim. This is a fantastic and critical post.
I relate to resonate with all of it. My mother at 83 changed overnight due to over zealous treatments. I know some doctors who left medicine because of the treatment of elders. They called it the goodbye program. Like your reference to the waiting room for God.
So much in here, and I love the reframe of your older friends, finding camaraderie and community to speak their rage and Joy
Please write about the dreaded falling, when I was younger I was never asked about falls or falling over. Once I was diagnosed with osteoporosis it the first question asked at every appointment was “have you had a fall?” As if I was constantly going to be tottering around having a fall. I may have tripped over something because I wasn’t looking, but I don’t consider that I “had a fall”.
Definitely, I am going to lie about this one. I had occasional unexplained falls when I was young. I am not going to let the medical team make assumptions about a fall now.
Another wonderful and thought provoking essay Kim. Kudos.
Politics aside, former president Joe Biden‘s prostate cancer diagnosis is a grim reminder that even the American Cancer Society recommends that routine PSA prostate cancer screening be discontinued at age 70. The argument seems to be that men will die of something else before they die of prostate cancer. What is really says is that once you’re over 70, your life matters less.
I agree, in Australia we have several free screening tests offered (bowel, mammograms and cervical cancer for example) but once you hit 70 they are normally discontinued although you can request them if you desire.
Shame has a bad reputation, I think because our first exposure was someone else using it as a weapon. If I identify something in my own behaviour as needing review, a little shame at the recognition won’t hurt me. Just between me and me.
Nope. No shame! We have enough of that. Just an understanding of what we do and why. It's always good to know why we do what we do and then we can ask ourselves if we want or need to change. Interestingly, studies show that people do better with people at the same physical, mental and emotional levels. Those folks challenge you and keep you moving forward!
Spot on! My adult daughters view me as old, a fall and general health risk. (I admit to silently laughing a little while sharing empathy as they bemoan parenting and perimenopause.) At 65 my health, according to lab work is stellar and I can hike miles and miles up and down mountains. You have given me permission to embrace myself as vibrantly being mid-life. Thank you!
This!!!! OhMyGoodness, yes! Thank you!
I am 83 and my husband is 84. We live in London and make a fair amount of use of the NHS. Everything you say rings true, in the sense that it sounds right, but it is NOT my experience. I am pretty healthy but every time I see a doctor, I feel he or she gives me all the time I need. I currently have a question mark over my breathing (I get out of breath easily) and expected doctors to say well, what do you expect, you're old. Not at all. They have sent me for checks of both heart and lungs (nothing amiss so far) and have treated me no differently than I would expect them to treat a young person. I attended a consultation of my husband with a heart doctor at a major hospital here in London and again, he could not have been more attentive.
I can't speak of other people's experience, but mine has been excellent.
I wonder if the British system is just more attentive? I really wonder if this a personal experience and you’ve hit the jack pot or if the American system is just a lot shittier? fascinating. And so happy i you have had a great experience.
Just a further note, that I asked said husband if he has experienced any poor treatment for being old and he said that with his most recent trip to the Emergency Department (just four weeks ago, he had had a fall and was concussed), he felt he got a little bit of priority because he was 84.
Well, everyone speaks about “The NHS” but really, it’s just a set of individual doctors with a common managerial system. We may be very lucky with the doctors we have seen, but I honestly have never heard any friend complain about how they were treated by doctors. (They complain a lot about waiting time and the difficulty of getting an appointment, but that’s a separate issue and affects everyone, not just old people.) I may ask friends, including one aged 100, as I meet them whether ageist prejudice is anything they have experienced.
I am American by background and 40+ years ago was pregnant in the US and worried I was having a miscarriage. My mother sent me to her gynaecologist who was incredibly patronising - my husband had to come into the consultation at one point and was shocked by the way the doctor talked to me. He said he was ready to punch him in the face!! In the end, I did have a miscarriage (on Labour Day, I always thought it was ironic) and the doctor in the local hospital was brilliant. But that’s another story. In the end, I did have a successful pregnancy who is now a middle aged academic teaching English literature.
The photographs are gorgeous! I'm interested in the Aronson book too. As always, a great read!
The quote at the end.🙏🙏
I love these two lines especially: "The stories they told, and laughed at, and raged over, were shared in the spirit of resistance. They were making sense of how they were being treated." As with most things about being human, the predominant ways to cope are laughter and/or rage. Our entire existence is absurd, and yet we come equipped with a brain that wants to "make sense of" it. I suppose that becomes more acute as we get closer to the end. ... Another interesting essay, Kim.
okay. i just lost my comment bc im tech challenged and this app is a mystery to me and i dont plan on doing anything to change that. so here it goes again:
I am super fascinated by all the beautiful (inside and out) active healthy wise-ones in this community. I can’t bring myself to use the “O” word. What I am most curious about is if they live in the US or overseas. The most notable thing to us both after living abroad is just how many “grey hairs” (everyone comfortable with that? lol) we see all over. traveling. biking. hiking. socializing. everywhere! and in the small community we live in my husband and i both in our 50’s are the spring chickens. where we moved from in the states was booming and we quickly started to feel that old folk treatment despite being super active and healthy. it’s something we’ve come to really appreciate here. quality of life no matter how old you are. i can’t help but feel that in the US we do tend to tuck “them” away. when was the last time you saw a group of 6-8 “grey hairs” cycling across country? we just had a retired 70-something build us a garage by hand. super fit guy lifting stones that would break out backs for months. you all are inspiring and have my full respect and admiration. IT. CAN. BE. DONE!
Fantastic! True beauty in the photos. Thank you!
I blame insurance too. I had a doctor tell me that he was "dinged" if he spent too much time with a patient. My prosthetist started his own business when his office was bought out by a corporation which wanted him to spend no more than 20 minutes with a patient, and that includes the time fitting the patient for a socket! Elders are neglected by many in the medical profession but the pressure to cut time. I talked maybe ten minutes with the doctor who just cut out my shoulder joint. The incision looks good, all seems good, but I deal with a physician assistant, not the technician - as I'm calling the no see him doctor. I'm sure it's cheaper but damn!
Thank you, this is all so important. Both my parents are dead now, my unhealthy dad from a sudden two week lung failure, my also unhealthy mom from a long slow nine year decline with dementia. In both cases, the local hospice organization was a godsend. People should know that hospice is not just for end of life care, but also for late-life advocacy. You might be able to get a hospice nurse or volunteer to help you advocate for your aging parents or for yourself. I annually give to our regional hospice organization because the people there do so much and are so needed.
Thank you for this reminder, Sarah. We should explore hospice more. I know they were a Godsend for my mom when my father was dying. He died at home and hopsice nurses and volunteers really kept her afloat emotionally. I need to lear more about the laste-in-life advocacy piece.
A couple of years before my mom died – when she was deep into dementia, but still had a lot of life in her – a hospice worker started visiting her regularly to check on her and make sure that her caregivers in the memory care unit of assisted living were giving her what she needed. I was only able to visit her once every one to two weeks, so it was reassuring to have another set of eyes on her and to know she was getting that extra bit of companionship.
You know, sometimes it’s better to have a person weighing in that doesn’t have a dog in the fight. This feels so essential to me.
Yes. But super hard to trust employees in facilities when they are treated very poorly by their corporate employers and have extremely high turnover, so still difficult to feel like someone else is there doing the job right. At the very, very end, though, hospice workers were essential in both of my parents' deaths. Key. Such an important role.
Why do we talk about our medical issues? Because that is what is going on in our lives! Simple.
A brilliant article. Will share widely.
Thanks so much, Gail!
Thank you, Kim. This is a fantastic and critical post.
I relate to resonate with all of it. My mother at 83 changed overnight due to over zealous treatments. I know some doctors who left medicine because of the treatment of elders. They called it the goodbye program. Like your reference to the waiting room for God.
So much in here, and I love the reframe of your older friends, finding camaraderie and community to speak their rage and Joy
Well, done.
Thanks, Prajna! “The Goodbye Program” OMG. That is harsh. LOL.
Please write about the dreaded falling, when I was younger I was never asked about falls or falling over. Once I was diagnosed with osteoporosis it the first question asked at every appointment was “have you had a fall?” As if I was constantly going to be tottering around having a fall. I may have tripped over something because I wasn’t looking, but I don’t consider that I “had a fall”.
Definitely, I am going to lie about this one. I had occasional unexplained falls when I was young. I am not going to let the medical team make assumptions about a fall now.
Oof. This is something that keeps resonnating. I reached out to Louise Aronson for her thoughts on this. Stay tuned….
Another wonderful and thought provoking essay Kim. Kudos.
Politics aside, former president Joe Biden‘s prostate cancer diagnosis is a grim reminder that even the American Cancer Society recommends that routine PSA prostate cancer screening be discontinued at age 70. The argument seems to be that men will die of something else before they die of prostate cancer. What is really says is that once you’re over 70, your life matters less.
It's true of colonoscopies too.
Bob! (Politics are fine.) and this is a great point I had t even considered. Thank you!
I agree, in Australia we have several free screening tests offered (bowel, mammograms and cervical cancer for example) but once you hit 70 they are normally discontinued although you can request them if you desire.
Your ‘Bruce Springsteen’ comments are thought-provoking.
I’m old, but I’m fit and have no medical issues so I mentally distance myself from the old who do. Do I need to be ashamed of that?
Shame has a bad reputation, I think because our first exposure was someone else using it as a weapon. If I identify something in my own behaviour as needing review, a little shame at the recognition won’t hurt me. Just between me and me.
Nope. No shame! We have enough of that. Just an understanding of what we do and why. It's always good to know why we do what we do and then we can ask ourselves if we want or need to change. Interestingly, studies show that people do better with people at the same physical, mental and emotional levels. Those folks challenge you and keep you moving forward!